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Technical Info: 3rd Generation: DRIVETRAIN Technical discussion of third generation (2003 - 2006) engine and drivetrain questions, solutions and upgrades.
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Old 07-11-2010
megacab3500 megacab3500 is offline
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Default Best cost effective way to lower EGT's

I would like some suggestions on what is the best cost effective way to lower my EGT's when towing my 5th wheel camper over hills and hold OD. I am very happy with the amount of power I have, but on long grades towing a 10K montana 5th wheel I am finding I am hitting the 1250 mark on the pyro and I am having to back down and go under the speed limit. I still have plenty of power, but I just don't want to melt down the engine. I am running the smarty JR in towing setting and the pyro is pre turbo. I know alot of you guys are going to say twin turbos or 5 inch exhaust, but its not in the budget right now. any other suggestions are welcomed. Also, oil, filter, and air filter were just changed...

thanks,


Scott
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Old 07-11-2010
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Chris H. Chris H. is offline
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You really don't have to start backing out of it until 1350 egt temp.

Some cost effective ways to get some lower egt's:
-Slow down, 10K is not actually light, or build up a little speed before the hills (not recommending breaking the law or safety)
-good air filter (amsoil drop in works nice) or BHAF
-Exhaust mods (flow through muffler) and maybe a true 4" downpipe. I found that even my 04.5 factory 4" exhaust was restrictive. There are several places to get a decent 4" cat back for under 300.00.


Not so cost effective:

-Turbo upgrade. A good single will do wonders for you.
-Meth injection system
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Old 07-11-2010
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cerberusiam cerberusiam is offline
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Your truck has been tested to 1450 degrees constant temp by Cummins when they ran the functional test in the Ram. Now, this was stock so adding the smarty changes things somewhat because it is more fuel and it is more timing. At 1300 seems to be a good place to put a hard stop on temp rise.

As for mods to reduce the max temps:

Boost fooler

Free flow muffler


Those are easy and economical. With the Smarty and a little tuning it should help.

For holding OD on grades if you can keep the EGT's under control, a mystery switch on the TC lockup sense wire will lock it in to OD with no downshift. If you have the power and the boost the EGT's are manageable if you keep it form downshifting most of the time. Depends on the grade and lethht though, that will cause variances.
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Old 07-17-2010
mawvelous mawvelous is offline
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Default Best cost effective way to lower EGT's

You mention that you "hold OD" I take that to mean that the truck is staying in OD and TC is in lock-up on hills. I tow a boat that weighs over 11K. Even stock the truck would often lock up on long grades below 6 %. This will cause EGT's to build quickly and you find that you have to slow down enough to keep out of lock up.

I recently made a trip using my Smarty Jr in SW 3. Timing 2 Torque 3. I used POD to control the above situation on hills. I would use POD 80 on flats and roll the power back into the 60-65 range before a hill. This would keep the trans from going into lock-up because of increased throttle to maintain speed. Whereas the EGT would climb past 1300 in the scenario you describe, using the Smarty to dial back power to prevent lock-up would keep EGT's in the 1000- 1100 range. I tow at 60-65 MPH. The tach is @ 1800 in lock-up and about 2200-2300 out of lock-up. This should be at the upper end of CR power range The Smarty seems to run about 150 degrees cooler than stock so you have already made a good investment toward lower EGT's. For some reason it seems to run about 100 degrees cooler (around 800 on flat ground) towing in SW3 vs SW2 when using POD w/SW3 with torque & timing set the same . I have not tried POD in SW2. Another interesting thing is I got 9.5 MPG when using this vs 7.5 - 8 MPG before. I do have water injection. I installed water injection before I got the Smarty. I use 2 nozzles and it flows about 12 GPM. I don't use Methanol. This is probably a little low as I have been told 16-19 GPM. If anything it may help with stopping temp build-up. I don't think my set-up lowers EGT. I probably would not have considered water injection if I had installed the Smarty first.

Cerberusiam and other forum members that may be familiar with this, I would be interested in your thoughts on this.
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Old 07-17-2010
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cerberusiam cerberusiam is offline
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Boost fooler and free flow muffler took right at 200 degrees off the max EGT's in stock settings. Almost never saw over 1300 degrees at any time unless it dropped a gear and unlocked to hold speed then it never made 1400 on any grade.

My truck has ALWAYS seen more EGT's at higher rpms. Even with a lockup switch on a stock tune at 2000 rpm's I could roll any grade and loose 15 mph with EGT's never topping 1200. The only thing I can think of is the boost fooler has been on fromt he time I started modding and its impact has been the difference.

If you have to drop out of OD to pull a normal grade on interstate hiways its short of air. With stock fueling you should be able to hold OD at 70 mph and never see much over 1300 EGT's, mor elikely 1200 is closer to what it will top out at on 3-5 mile grade.

With the Smarty my truck almost never downshifts on grade and I can't remember the last time it broke 1200 degrees on EGT's with a 10-15k trailer in tow. Those numbers can and will differ with the amount of air your trailer pushes, boats suck. They are some of the worst for drag of any load.
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Last edited by cerberusiam; 07-17-2010 at 04:37 PM..
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Old 07-18-2010
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Gary Thornton Gary Thornton is offline
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cerberusium, what Smarty settings do you prefer for towing?
SW 3 on default settings or SW4? Or something else?
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2 '05 2500 4x4,QC's 48RE,3.73,Limited Slip,Plow Prep,Linex,ROKK,Afe 2 & Amsoil fluids (Boss 9'2" V-blades )

#1 SMARTY cr(SW3),TOYO/AT2's 285-70/17E's,Quad Commander,TransGo shift kit,Prodigy,Fold-a-cover,60 gal RDS aux tank,Corsa exhaust,FASS95/95 3 micron,Mag-Hytec DD tran pan,Bilsteins.
Pull a Cameo 5er (8800 lbs empty)

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Old 07-18-2010
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cerberusiam cerberusiam is offline
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Best results so far have been SW3, Timing 3, Rail pressure 2, TQ management 3 towing 10-15k. I can bump the SW to 4 with pretty good results if I am at 10k and under.

The new Revo version of Smarty has changed the pressure ramps and cleaned a lot of the smoke up that was inherent in the earlier versions. Above SW4 or 5 its too much smoke in low boost conditions without changing tubos to probably twins to handle the fuel.
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1992 D250 47RH Billet TC and other assorted goodies, 370 nozzles, built pump, 3.55 LS
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  #8  
Old 07-18-2010
mawvelous mawvelous is offline
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Default Best cost effective way to lower EGT's

I can't argue with the lack of air in lock-up. The need to run @ higher RPM's is to increase air flow. Using a tuner may excaberbate this vs stock up hill in lock-up.
Since the guages were not added until after signature mods were completed. I am going to try towing the boat with stock settings the next time out and see what the difference is.
Having a 28 ft boat is great. We fish all day often times more than 8 hours. Breakfast is hot served from the galley, plenty of cold beverages and a bathroom is nice among other amenities. Towing it can be a hassle: over width load permits etc.
Also this size of boat was not really designed to be trailerable, It is tongue light.
I have had to make a few trailer mods over the years to address that. As far as drag you are probably right. What can really be a problem is side wind loads. At 13 feet high on trailer and with the length it can act like a sail and you can get "the tail wagging the dog" in winds over 25 MPH.

My brother -in -law's 2004.5 CR has the same concerns pulling a 25 ft travel trailer: His EGT's climb past 1200 pretty fast. He has a 6 speed and shifts back to 5th to bring EGT down on hill. He has a BD power pup, and Donaldson muffler and AFE intake.
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  #9  
Old 07-18-2010
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Gary Thornton Gary Thornton is offline
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[QUOTE=cerberusiam;1872511]Best results so far have been SW3, Timing 3, Rail pressure 2, TQ management 3 towing 10-15k. I can bump the SW to 4 with pretty good results if I am at 10k and under.
QUOTE]

And when empty what gives you the best MPG's?
Thanks
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2 '05 2500 4x4,QC's 48RE,3.73,Limited Slip,Plow Prep,Linex,ROKK,Afe 2 & Amsoil fluids (Boss 9'2" V-blades )

#1 SMARTY cr(SW3),TOYO/AT2's 285-70/17E's,Quad Commander,TransGo shift kit,Prodigy,Fold-a-cover,60 gal RDS aux tank,Corsa exhaust,FASS95/95 3 micron,Mag-Hytec DD tran pan,Bilsteins.
Pull a Cameo 5er (8800 lbs empty)

#2 SUPERCHIPS flashpaq,BFG/AT's TA 315-70/17's,& MBRP

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  #10  
Old 07-18-2010
Dorkweed
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I tow most everyday and leave my Smarty Revo on SW5 default settings. I tried the added timing, but got timing rattle. Granted, my work trailer and my boat aren't near as big as what y'all are towing, and "The Peoples Republic of Illinois" is pretty flat in most parts; but I do tow all the time and have figured some stuff out. Very rarely to I even see 1000* when towing. On the occasion that I do, it's usually because I'm lugging the engine by not going fast enough or I'm in too high a gear, or both. I've done some real big long grades in KY and WI towing and as long as I could keep the speed and boost, the EGT's stayed fine. Try building your boost before you actually start the incline.....that should help some vs. adding go pedal on the incline when speed drops.
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