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watersedge13
03-28-2006, 09:07 AM
I bought an 06 Megacab DRW a week ago today, was washing truck Sat. morning and noticed that it did not have clearenc lights. Kn/owing that this was illegal I called Chrysler and they said that 71 trucks had been sent out door that did not meet DOT requirement statue 401 and there has been a bulliten to all dealers. Now I'm without truck for a day while they install the lights. Just a little heads up to everyone buying a 3500 truck

chiefforever
03-28-2006, 07:35 PM
That's a BUMMER! What a thing to have a recall for. I'd make sure they did a good job installing the lights before I'd take it back.

Canyonero02
03-28-2006, 08:46 PM
Do all 1 tons need clearance lights? I have them on my F350 but they were an option, not standard.

rjm022ny
03-28-2006, 08:54 PM
all duallies need them. yeah-make sure they do the job right!!. i had a buddy that had cab lights put on his truck at the dealer. when he picked it up- he noticed many, many scratches on the roof and a-pillar of his truck, from the mechanics belt buckle -believe it or not-the dealer admitted it.

MAXTORQ
03-28-2006, 08:58 PM
Accually it was 275 trucks.

Recall notice that I was going to publish here.

States:

1ton trucks built at the Saltillo assembly plant with the vin code G in the 11th position .Built from Dec 20 of 05 to Feb. 15th 06

Inavertantly manufactured with out roof clearance lights. Vehicle fails Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards. NO# 108 for Reflective Devices and associated equipment. /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/cool.gif

TimHolt
03-28-2006, 10:13 PM
Understanding DOT regulations can be a real pain. To sum up the reasons for the clearence lights give the DOT officers a quick reference as to the tonnage of the vehicle, besides the safety equipment thats required on trucks that exceed certian GVWs. Some 3/4 to vehicles actually have a capacity rating of over a ton and require them, some dont. ALL DUAL WHEEL trucks HAVE to have them, and this includes the 3/4 ton Ford duallys. All one ton trucks, whether or not its a dually, have the GVW rating requireing clearence lights. Some 3/4 ton trucks fall under the required saftey requirements and then can be an option,,,,,to a point.

NO 1/2 ton truck should sport clearance lights and that is enforced in some states, if you have them on a 1/2 ton and they are ON (operating) while on a state controlled road you can be cited for misrepresenting the tonnage of your truck. Some people put them on just to be "cool", yet some that know the laws and try to skirt them at night will try to use a 1/2 ton or an under rated 3/4 to to pull or haul loads over rated for the truck and is dangerous. They try to run those loads under the cover of night with the clearance lights to misrepresent the truck as to having the correct rating. They do this because 1/2 tons and light 3/4 tons are cheaper to buy, register and insure.

If you think about it, clearance lights dont have any safety value at all, even on the big rigs. They dont provide enough light to light up low bridge clearance to keep from knocking off the cab, thats why bridge heights are posted on them. One tons or the heavy 3/4 ton and even the medium duty trucks fall way short of the height of the big rigs. Safety wise for the user they are useless, 1/2 tons stand as tall as the one tonners and taller for the lifted, big tire 4X4s and they are not required on them. The safety factor is telling the troopers what you are and meet the requirements for what your doing.

rjm022ny
03-28-2006, 10:47 PM
i believe cab lights on the 3500 srw trucks are now an option- no longer standard equipment!!.

TimHolt
03-28-2006, 11:13 PM
Not unless DOT has changed their laws, ALL one tons a required, reread MAXs post. He gives you the law that requires them.

MAXTORQ
03-28-2006, 11:17 PM
Yes all 1 ton Dodge trucks require them. And as Tim said even the heavy 3/4's require them too. Such as mine. /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/cool.gif

harleyguy
03-29-2006, 06:19 AM
I know my SRW has the lights.I didn`t know though that it was the law.learn some thing new every day huh?

STATELINE
03-29-2006, 07:28 AM
I've seen some 06 3500 srw trucks on the lots without them, I remember reading somewhere they where required due to the width of duallys?? doesn't make sense, but I saw it somewhere

watersedge13
03-29-2006, 12:01 PM
it is at the shop right now being done, Truck should be done by noon

rjm022ny
03-29-2006, 07:14 PM
hey tim/max- i went to d/c site and built a 3500 srw truck. it shows the cab lighs as an option-now! so we all have learned something new today! here is a post from another dodge forum site from weeks ago--

Originally Posted by johnny1509
I was playing around building a truck on Dodge's website and when I did the single rear wheel option, it said it deleted the clearance lights. I noticed they were available as an option for $80.00. Another cost savings move by DC I suppose.


Correct, they're an option on 3500srw's for '06. I'm glad because I prefer no lights on the roof and my new 3500 Mega Cab won't have them.
here is a post from another dodge forum site from weeks ago.
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnny1509

Drivinfool
03-29-2006, 07:29 PM
I haven't got anything else to add that hasn't already been covered...but I'm dying to know watersedge if you have a picture you can post of your '06. I've been looking but I can't find a picture of a Megacab Dually anywhere. Was yours a special order, i.e. commercial, or utility bed etc. I'm chompin at the bit to see it.

Too_Tall
03-29-2006, 07:38 PM
Watersedge has posted some pics already. here is the thread.

http://dieselram.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=000969

Drivinfool
03-29-2006, 07:44 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Too_Tall:
Watersedge has posted some pics already. here is the thread.

http://dieselram.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=000969 </div></div>Thanks Too Tall. Just checked it out. SWEEEEEEET.

watersedge13
03-30-2006, 11:03 AM
Here are some picks, I included some other picks of sleds livestock trailers and flatbed trailers with loads of spool trailers on them. lights loo9k great, they did an excellent job.

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/30205002@NOO/" target="_blank">http://www.flickr.com/photos/30205002@NOO/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/30205002@NOO/)</a>

watersedge13
03-30-2006, 11:05 AM
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/30205002@N00/" target="_blank">http://www.flickr.com/photos/30205002@N00/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/30205002@N00/)</a>

TimHolt
03-30-2006, 12:31 PM
I went to Doidges web site to build me a truck, SRW, SLT QUAD cab 3500 short bed. Sure enough, part of the option was cab lights,,,,,, until you try to build the truck and it makes you accept changes to the build order and then its standard equipment.

Just to verify, this morning I went up the street to the local Dodge dealer and sat down with a salesman to build the same custom truck at their store. Again the same results. I then turned to him and said that I dont want that feature. WHY, he asked. I told him that I am going to mount an equipment rack on it and those lights are just in the way. At that point I had 4 guys scutteling all over getting books and what ever trying to find out why they have to be there, not an option on that truck, showed them as an option untill we build it. After a little more than hour one guy shows up with the bulletin that there some trucks built without them and they have to be installed before they can be sold citing the DOT law. He told me that IF wanted to remove them later thats up to me but they have to be on there before the truck could be sold. He also stated that has been other features that are listed on the web site that causes some confusion from time to time and are either standard equipment or just not offered, different than on the site.

Not having clearence lights on those trucks are as illegal as a dually without mud flaps he said, its fedral law and sometimes manufactures make mistakes that the dealer has to correct. He said that they also recieved 10 duallys without the mud flaps and nobody caught it untill a customer with a ticket showed back up ****ed off because of the missing flaps. A couple of days later they got paid a visit from state officials and fined the dealer for each truck on the lot and sold as unsafe vehicles.

They also paid the customers ticket.

Its amazing what you can learn when the DOT has you on the side of the road,,,,,,huh.

Too_Tall
03-30-2006, 01:07 PM
I just ordered a truck (see sig). I know I choose not to have the lights. I was explicitly asked just as I was about the other options and I said no to the cab lights. I guess that I will see what happens when I get it. I don't really care if I have the lights or not, so I wasn't going to pay extra to get them.

TimHolt
03-30-2006, 01:19 PM
It will be interesting, let us know.

Just went to lunch and pulled up next to a BRAND NEW, still with dealer tags on it, Dodge quad cab Cummins 4X4 2500, black nice truck,,,,,NO cab lights! Darn.

rjm022ny
03-30-2006, 05:48 PM
the wife works less than a mile from a dodge dealership. she went through the lot this morning before work. she called me and told me there was two 3500 srw trucks with no cab lights!!.

Loki99
03-30-2006, 06:34 PM
My 2500 came with out them what makes it a Lite 3/4? /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif

russ21
03-30-2006, 06:41 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Tim Holt:
It will be interesting, let us know.

Just went to lunch and pulled up next to a BRAND NEW, still with dealer tags on it, Dodge quad cab Cummins 4X4 2500, black nice truck,,,,,NO cab lights! Darn. </div></div>They were an option on mine. Also, has anyone tried to build a 3500 SRW long bed on the Dodge site? I can't seem to get through it.

Jayri
03-30-2006, 10:26 PM
After searching the net for the last half hour, Clearance lights are a width thing...only required on duallys. Thats why those GM pickups with Quadrasteer have clearance lights because of those rear wheel flares. Just do a search on the internet and you will come across the Federal guidelines.

blord
03-31-2006, 05:46 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Jayri:
After searching the net for the last half hour, Clearance lights are a width thing...only required on duallys. Thats why those GM pickups with Quadrasteer have clearance lights because of those rear wheel flares. Just do a search on the internet and you will come across the Federal guidelines. </div></div>Where did you find the info on duallys? The only regs I found applied only to "commercial" vehicles that exceed 80" in width.

Need to know, have a 3500 dually on order without the lights.

Thanks

rjm022ny
03-31-2006, 06:36 AM
duallies require the cab lights-due to the width of the truck. i don't see how you could of ordered it without lights-(must have something to do with the salesman!) your truck will arrive at the dealership with cab lights!

camillit
03-31-2006, 08:49 AM
In the 2006 Dodge Sales brochure, clearance lights are NOT AVAILABLE on the 1500, OPTIONAL on 2500's and 3500's (SRW), and STANDARD on 3500 DRW.
SO ENDUTH THE LESSON.............

TimHolt
03-31-2006, 09:50 AM
Not yet,,,, try to delete the clearence lights on the 3500 SRW. It wont let you, standard equipment on the 3500.

dennisdrummonds
03-31-2006, 09:56 AM
What's up with the mudflaps? Are you talking about rear fenders or mudflaps. I consider mudflaps the things semi trucks have. None of the duallys are sold around here with them.

TimHolt
03-31-2006, 10:57 AM
All dual wheel vehicles are required to have them, Fedral law. All trucks equipped with dual wheels must have them including dual wheel trailers, no matter how small the truck or trailer. Better go look again, they all should have them or the seller and owner is breaking fedral law and will be cited for not having them. Last year I was stopped for one of mine missing (unaware that it came off) and the trooper pulled me over in my park entrance. Since I was allready home he didnt ticket me but said get it back on before driving it again. When I got to my park slip I found my mud flap. When I backed into my slip, I had back up to those big railroad ties and caught the mud flap between the tire and railroad tie, popped right off. It tore the mounting holes out of the flap so to the dealer I went. A new set of mud flaps and retainers cost me $40.00 bucks and took about an hour to put them on.

The reason all dual wheels are required to have them is to prevent big rocks or other debris from being caught between the tires and thrown into the windsheid of the vehicle behind you. IF that happens and your truck is a dually without mud flaps you can land in jail, be liable for damages and injuries to others, big fines and lawsuits will come rolling down on you for not having proper safety equipment on your truck. Also your mud flaps cant be more than 10 inches off the ground (I belive thats right) and those that lift duallys must extend the mud flaps. You will not get a safety sticker here without them or too high off the ground. You can be ticketed for the same reasons.

TimHolt
03-31-2006, 12:20 PM
Here is the Federal motor vehicle lighting requirements link. Get ready, it is a very long read, confusing to sort thru and includes all motor vehicles.

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/...=1999&TYPE=TEXT (http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/get-cfr.cgi?TITLE=49&PART=571&SECTION=108&YEAR=1999&TYPE=TEXT)

Have fun, took me a couple of hours to sort out.

Too_Tall
03-31-2006, 02:20 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Here is the Federal motor vehicle lighting requirements link. Get ready, it is a very long read, confusing to sort thru and includes all motor vehicles.

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/...=1999&TYPE=TEXT (http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/get-cfr.cgi?TITLE=49&PART=571&SECTION=108&YEAR=1999&TYPE=TEXT)

Have fun, took me a couple of hours to sort out. </div></div>Tim, After looking at that a little, it states that a vehicle that is under 80" wide and has a gross vehicle weight rating of less than 10,000#, Clearance lights are not mandatory. On the 3500 SRW the GVWR is only 9,900# where the DRW has a GVWR of about 11,000# or so. This is not to be confused with the GCWR, which for either truck is above 20,000#. Only the GVWR is considered in mandating Clearance lights in the cited article.

TimHolt
03-31-2006, 04:11 PM
I know but keep going. It gets better. Thats why I said it gets confusing.

But thats OK, the dealer shouldnt deliver a vehicle thats illegal for highyway use. If its legal without them then who am I to argue, I dont write the laws. If its not legal then the people that took delivery will be looking back to the dealer to get it straight, after they have been fined and/or impounded.

Like I said before, those lights serve no purpose other than to identify the truck. If they werent required I would imagine DC sure wouldnt spend the money putting them on. That would be just that much more in their back pocket.

rjm022ny
03-31-2006, 07:19 PM
drove by the dodge dealership after we went out for a fish fry. two 3500 srw trucks without cab lights and four 3500 srw trucks with cab lights. choose your poison-want a 3500 srw truck with or wothout the lights?

stlouisdon66
03-31-2006, 08:41 PM
I do not know the regulations and didn't care to. Not trying to disagree with Tim as he knows a helluva lot more than I ever will about these regulations but my guess is it either truly has to do with the width AND gvwr of the vehicle or some newbie engineer at dodge (probably the same guy that thought a tranny only needs tow/haul and not OD lockout for '05 as well as the stupid not-in-park horn) misread the regulations and let way too many trucks be built withouth them. Here is what I have seen. I bought my boss a 3500 srw megacab last month. It does not have clearance lights. Does have "g" in the 11th position but was built on or around oct 10th 2005. Now there are have to be more than 275 3500 srw's out there because we looked at over 15 in the midwest region and I would say 10 of them did not have clearance lights I know this because he origally had to have them but since he needed factory nav/dvd/sunroof he decided he didn't need them that bad.
How can dodge even let them be sold if they violate federal Law?
Anyway sorry for the long post. I guess i will wait for the recall notice and pleasantly surprise the boss when he gets them.

burkeb
03-31-2006, 09:51 PM
New to the forum, just bought my new 3500 srw a month ago. It has no clearance lights -- on the window sticker where it lists "single rear wheel group", one of the items underneath this heading states "delete clearance lamps", so it appears to me that if you aren't getting a a drw, it is added only as an option, at least in my case. I haven't tried to build it on the website to see what happens, though.

TimHolt
04-01-2006, 03:55 AM
They may have changed the regulations on them and I am all wet. Not the first time thats happened. Still working from old school so to speak. If thats happened then I stand corrected.

blord
04-06-2006, 07:23 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by Tim Holt:
All dual wheel vehicles are required to have them, Fedral law. </div></div>Hey Tim, I sent a message to NHTSA DOT asking if duallys needed mudflaps. They sent me a link to their vehicle requirements that include the one you mentioned about clearance lights.

http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/waisidx_05/49cfr571_05.html

I can't find anything on mudflaps or "dual" in any of them. Is it possible that is a state law rather than federal.

Wondering because I have a dually on order and want to know how much grief to give the dealer if it doesn't have mudflaps. There are 2 on their lot that don't have them.

Thanks,
Bryan

blord
04-07-2006, 10:33 AM
Tim, I got this back from the DOT research library ... there isn't a federal regualtion requiring mudflaps but may be a state law.

We spoke to several people at the FMCSA and they don't know of any federal regulations on mud flaps. To find out if your state has any such rules, contact the state DOT directly.

Links to state Departments of Transportation and/or state government web sites are available on: http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/webstate.htm.

Sincerely,

Reference Service Staff
National Transportation Library
Bureau of Transportation Statistics
Research and Innovative Technology Administration
U.S. Department of Transportation

J Ray
04-07-2006, 08:08 PM
My truck was purchased new by a moble home dealer
and its 3/4 ton with dealer installed clearence
lights. I was told that he sold a 24' camper
that was a fraction over the leagle width and
dot had him do it. Just hear say by someone at
the dealer.

blord
04-07-2006, 11:41 PM
The fed reg that I found states only vehicles over 80" are required to have them. According to the Dodge brochure the width of a 2500/3500 (SRW) is 79.9" so under the limit.

Duallys must have them.

TimHolt
04-08-2006, 09:32 PM
Ok, a LOT of rereading ad digging thru federal regulations (which have changed over the last several years) this is the skinny. I mis-spoke when a cited federal law, sorry. It federal regulation, this is only regulatory rule that DOT requires to make the safety equipment manufacture, placement, color, candle power, type and so on a uniform standard for all vehicle manufactures to use as a strict guideline. The reason that all lighting has a DOT number as well as other safety equipment. This is the book that I have used to follow the rules with, regulation, not enforcement law. Its been a number of years since I have had to refer to it and mixed it up as a federal law book, my bad, sorry. The reason is two fold for the standards, it keeps different states from requireing the manufacturer to build vehicles just for that state and manufacturers from building vehicles that are differing greatly from others in lighting and other safety equipment. There are, however, federal law on commercial trucks that extend all the way down to the light truck duallies. The requirement of other lower class safety equipment has changed for the lighter single wheel pickups and is left to the individual states for the requirements.

Clearance lights, ALL duallies are required to have them. One ton and less single wheel, may or may not be required depending on the state law. This means if you dont have them in a state that requires them and move to that state and establish residence, you will have to install them. Not all states are requireing them now and the reason they are now an option at the dealer in some states. Previous laws by federal regulation required them on any pickup or van or cab and chassis that had a weight rating with of 10,001 lbs or more, combined truck and rated carring capacity. They are only required now as a width indicator at 98+ inches in width and must be operating at dusk to dawn, and must be required as enforcement in all states. The load capacity has been dropped several years ago.

It also keeps you from putting five 150 watt sealed beams on your one ton 4X4 cab and calling them claerance lights! /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/Evil.gif

Mudflaps, once a federal regulation required for enforcement in all states on any vehicle with dual rear tires has also changed but only in light trucks (one ton and less) as an option of enforcement for each state. Or required as safety equipment on a one ton registered as a commercial truck (hot shot carrier) or if the fender does not cover the tires below the center of the axle. I can see many gray and/or confusion areas of enforcement here. But here is the deal, if your a dually and do not have mudflaps in good condition, even if they are not required in your state, and your truck throws a brick (or like object) at another vehicle, a good laywer can win by citing federaly regulated uniform manufacture of safety equipment that really should be there whether or not it was sold without or not required in that state. They will state that if the owner/driver of the truck had been in good consience installed them then the incident would have never happend (opinion) and wouldnt be in court sueing you especially since these parts are readily avalable for purchase for your specfic truck. Its a liability law that all states use. Its up to you to make sure your vehicle is safe around others.

These are federal rules for the uniform manufacture of the DOT approved safety products, not rules of enforcement. DOT rules, different book. State laws of requirements and enforcement vary from state to state, but DOT approved products must be used and installed by DOT approved methods IF required in your state.

I was right about this, years ago. Just havent kept up with it so now I learned something. Sorry, didnt mean to mislead. Its old farts syndrom. /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

blord
04-09-2006, 01:30 AM
Hi Tim,
I certainly wasn't trying to get on your case and I know you weren't intentionally giving misleading information!!!!

I was concerned because I have a dually on order (7-9 weeks to go now) and wanted to know how much pressure to put on the dealer to install mudflaps. They have 2 sitting on the lot without them. They aren't required in Colo.

So I have been told that there ARE some states that require them on dual tired vehicles. I have every intention of putting them on because I tow a 5ver and don't want to bung up the front of it.

But, for figure of argument what happens if I'm towing without them and travel into a state that requires them. Do they issue a ticket, give a warning, impound the vehicle. Just curious.

I read not too long ago that one of the states (CA I think) was going to start enforcing a law they have on their books that RV drivers/towers must have a "Non commercial drivers license". This isn't a standard drivers license but something that requires some of the CDL stuff. Colo. doesn't offer anything like this so would that make me illegal? I think this is what the Feds were trying to do with their regs so that interstate commerce wasn't affected by "local" laws. Unless I'm mistaken, the feds mandated that right turn on red was to be nation wide. Colo. in the 60s used that as a revenue source by nailing out-of-staters who were here for vacation.

Tim, thanks for making me dig and do some thinking. I did order the dually without lights (dealer can apparently remove them from the order because the mgr came over to confirm that I didn't want them). After reading your post and digging in the regs I found out that I had to have them so called them and changed the order. Now as someone stated, they probably would have been on the truck when I received it anyway but I don't want anything TO HOLD UP THE ORDER!!!!!!!

Sold my 2001 CTD today so now I'm truckless!

TimHolt
04-10-2006, 12:05 AM
If your visiting another state that requires them then they cant require you to have them, unless you register in that state, like Texas, big fines if your registered here without them. But if your state doesnt require them then Texas cant write you up for it. Same for the drivers licenses.

Some states dont require a motorcycle endoresment, Texas does. But if your in Texas without the endorsement from a state that dosent have it, your good, untill you move to Texas.

But they will get you for no seatbelts regardless, that notofication is at the state line.

dennisdrummonds
04-10-2006, 07:55 AM
Thanks for the info Tim. I am going to install mudflaps on my dueller. I think it is a good idea. Any one have any pics. or suggestions?

blord
04-11-2006, 06:14 AM
Someone posted this site: They look pretty good to me especially the one towards the bottom.

http://www.omnicast.net/~nwcustom/mudflaps.html